EPISODE 19 – Common Beliefs In The Building Industry
Hi and welcome to another episode of Builders Business Success Podcast!
If you have ever seen the podcast before, or listened to the podcast before, its purpose is to eliminate the unnecessary pain that most builders experience, whether it be financial or stress, not enough work, too much work.
Generally, most of those problems are caused by the way that builders go about their business. It’s the building industry norms, kind of everyone does it the same way.
We’re offering you ideas and solutions to do it a different way, so your business is better, it’s more profitable, your customers love you, your team has a good time, everything about your business is better.
The reason for this conversation is, over the last little while we’ve been putting a lot of information out on Facebook and so forth about builders charging for quotes, how do you get better quality customers?
How do you get great relationships with customers?
So there’s openness and they’ll tell you what their budget is. And, how do we get rid of the time wasters, and the price shoppers and the price checkers, all of that sort of stuff out of the business?
Since we’ve been putting this information out, there’s been a lot of people who love it, and there’s been a few people who are quite critical of it, saying it’s impossible, can’t work, what would you know, all of this sort of stuff.
The point of this conversation is to give you some proof from some people who believe that, or were experiencing those problems of price checkers, time wasters, people always being focused on price. And from some builders who never ever thought it was possible to get paid for a quote.
There’s a lot of, I guess common beliefs out there in the building industry. And a lot of those common beliefs are at the core of a lot of the problems, the pain, the frustration, the difficulty of running a building business.
*Transcription of the show*
Hear my conversation with Our Members!
So I’ve got a bunch of people that we’re talking to. This is a little bit different for Builders Business Success Podcast, we normally speak to one person, we’ve got a bunch of people on this conversation.
So, we’ll get to each one of you in turn. But, I’d just like to hear first from Phil and Cherie. So they’re building business down in Tassie, about what your dream or desire was, right at the start of your building business ’cause I believe you’ve been in the game for about 30 years.
– Yeah, I’ve been in the game for over 30 years. But, well I started running my own business about 10 years ago. And, probably the main reason was to have a bit more freedom, earn a little bit more money. And I thought it was gonna be pretty easy, but it sort of turned the table a little bit, because all of a sudden I always seemed to be working for the business instead of the business working for me. So, but the dream was, I like making dreams come true for families.
So, that was the main part, it was not good to dream for a young family or an older family, and let their dreams be, happen in that side. That was us for the 10 years or so. And yeah, we still build some more dreams for people.
– Yeah, perfect. Louise, tell us about what you wanted. Like why the hell did you get involved in your own business? What was going on through your brain?
– Yeah, like Phil and Cherie, it was the same reasons really. We wanted to have some time for ourselves, extra time, and the flexibility of running our own business, and to be profitable to, you know, the money part of it, and again to help people achieve happiness in their own homes, by creating dream spaces for them.
– Yeah, got Andrew and I’ve got Geoff. They’re business partners in a building business in Penrith, New South Wales. Which one of you would like to tell us what your thoughts were before you got started? Andrew put his hand up.
– Yeah, I probably started more for ego reasons. So being self employed in the building industry since the ’80s, mostly with project builders, I just wanted to prove that I could do a better job myself.
This company has been going for 10 years now. And I haven’t quite got to where I expected it to be. I started reaching out for help. I’m quite skeptical that anyone could know as much about running a business as I thought I did. That turns out I didn’t know much at all. So it’s very helpful.
– Geoff, what was going through your mind? Like you obviously found our information, the Builders Business Blackbelt sort of information out there in Facebook, land or wherever. And we were talking about charging for quotes and getting better quality clients and all of that sort of stuff.
And I just remember our first conversation. And please don’t take this the wrong way. But you probably weren’t the most open to what was possible. What was going through your brain? Tell us about your cynicism and your doubt.
– The reason I started looking around for alternatives ’cause obviously, we were in a position where we had a few difficult clients that we had been working with, that level of inquiry was down due to, you know, the industry and the COVID thing and all sorts of things that were outside of our control. We needed something as a direction to, there has to be a better solution.
We’re looking for communication with other builders that had similar sort of issues and trying, you know, just share knowledge and find out how that was to, how you get to a better position than where were in. You know, comes back to things like charging for quotes, and maybe not taking on every job that walked in the door was an unheard of approach for us. But for the last few years, we basically took every job that came in the system, right or wrong, dealt with some pretty great customers along the way, but also one or two that put a real sour taste on how our whole operation, so.
– What was going through your brain now when we first talked about that, because we were talking about charging for quotes, which made you nervous from my recollection. What were you thinking? What were your doubts?
– I guess my role in this business is I handle all the sales components and deal with the customers on a first point of call. What it felt like for us for the last few years, it’s just about every inquiry comes in on price base only. So everyone contacts you looking for the cheapest quote, or that’s what it seemed like anyway. To develop a system, now that doesn’t operate that way, that actually weeds those components out. It’s a no brainer to me the change has been amazing.
– From from my recollection, you were going well, it sounds like a good idea but, you know, I think you’ve been smoking crack. That was the vibe I was getting.
– Maybe that’s a better way to put it but I’m trying to be more diplomatic I suppose.
– We don’t do that here.
– We are in the belief or of the belief that, you know, the client drove the conversation that the clock that, you know, we had to compete on price to win the job. And that’s what whole process was all about. To believe that that could be changed was pretty, you know, mind boggling to start with to think that you could actually drive and dictate to the client of almost when you make the appointments to whether you compete on price with even mentioned price at the start of the project. I mean, it can’t be that now that you actually getting into the information and the compatibility of the job rather than the end price of the job.
– I think Jeff and I have two traits that are similar. And we’re both skeptical of people, especially outside the industry. We sat and spoke, you know, how could a fast-talking fella from Hobart.
– From Tasmania.
– That’s not even a builder. How could he tell us anything positive towards our business in Penrith, Western Sydney? We’re competing with a market that you don’t even know Mick.
– Totally, what the hell would I know? And you’re 100% right, you are 100% right. I do not know your business. I did not know any of your businesses. All we were pushing forward were principles. In the beginning believed would work but now that we’ve been doing it for sort of half a dozen years specifically with builders now it works. And that’s why I’ve got you guys here. I want other people to hear about that the transition of being fully skeptical, thinking I was full of it, whatever the reality of your situation was back then to your journey over the last probably 15, 16 weeks. That’s the length of time that all of us have known each other, is about 16 weeks. That’s not very long in the scheme of things, you know. And we’ll get to that in a minute, you know, what has changed. But I want people to understand that it’s totally okay that they’re skeptical, that they don’t think this is possible. All I want to accomplish with this conversation is to open the door a little bit to some possible openness about looking and applying it to their business. So they too can enjoy the benefits that you guys are going to talk about in just a little while. Cherie, tell us about what your experience was when you first sort of started talking to us. Before you started like deciding whether you should jump on the blueprint program or not. What were yours and Phil’s discussions?
– Well, Phil was not on actually found through because he was in hospital at the time, sort of said on the phone to me. I’ve just found this dude on Facebook.
– Yeah. He says that we can charge for quote. So no way, we don’t believe that. So how do you do that?
– What did you actually say? Because I doubt whether you would have said, don’t believe that.
– I said bullshit. I sort of, be it bullshit really. And Phil said, “Well, I’ve actually booked us in for a meeting.” And I went, “What, what did you do that for.” And he goes on, ” I want to hear him, I want to see what he has to say.” And I said, “Okay, let’s do it.” We’ll be interested to see what he actually tells us and the guy was very skeptical to start with and I said, I think you’re wasting your time for you. But he said, “Oh well, I’ve booked it now. So let’s see what he has to say.” So that’s when we talk to you. And even in that first meeting, I said to God and I’m still not 100% convinced.
– What was going on in your business at that time? Like what did it look like as far as your level of enjoyment, how much time you’re putting into it and the results you’re getting?
– For me, I was probably putting more time in the business, Phil was actually on the tools a lot more. Honestly, I got to the stage where I just said, I don’t think I want to be in the building industry anymore. You know, I come on board with Phil when he started the business. And I went and did my builder’s license to make it easier so I could implement things in the business. But then I got to the stage I just didn’t want to be in the business anymore. I actually went and started a new course to look at going out and working for someone else, because that’s where my attitude was, I just said no I can’t do it anymore.
– Yeah, so when Cherie did that I got into a bit of a dark area where, well, if she’s not going to be there to help me, there’s no way I could do this on my own. So I was actually getting ready to give up as well. And then the main part was like spending hours and hours in here doing quote after quote after quote same as Geoff and Andrew. Anything that come through the door I do on quote, even knowing sometimes that you was going to be a check price anyway, still do it because you feel obligated to do it.
– And just to be clear, what you’re talking about now was reality only 17, 18 weeks ago.
– Absolutely right.
– Yeah, and I think it put a pressure on not only the business but our marriage. And, you know, I think it just got to the stage where we thought, okay, well, where do we go from here?
– Business took over our life, we didn’t have one side. And I was worried about bills and everything else and try win any job that come through the door, and then we’ll pry some ridiculous prices just to get work.
– So one of the first things that you guys get exposed to so you’ve decided, okay, we’re going to give this a crack. This is the blueprint, the black belt program, the 12-week program that all you guys went through. The first thing that you’re presented with is a thing called the personal success ritual. For those listening it’s a 10, 12 minute activity that we ask people to do at the start of each day. Louise, tell us about your experience with that, and obviously Andy’s, Andy is not here today, but we can talk about him behind his back, tell us what his experience was and your experience was just by implementing that one thing.
– That was just a game changer in itself for us. And, you know, just give us so much focus every morning. I think I’ve missed one day, Andy hasn’t missed a day at all doing it. And we do it every morning as soon as we get up, we listen to our motivation video, we do our 60 second success story and then we set our goals. And from that, then we create our daily action list, our prioritized daily action list and just everything flows into the other. It really has made us or helped us with ideas with really focusing on what our goals are and how we get to those. And every day we do try and get, you know, in our prioritized daily action list something to help us achieve those goals that we try and get to know.
– Who else here has got something to say about their experience with the PSR.
– PSR is probably the thing that I struggle with the most, I find it very difficult to get motivated by watching a sportsman, a politician or a movie star. And I’ve motivated myself in my head, but to actually leave the room and sit down with a diary and try and write some goals and write something to motivate me has been the most difficult part of the course and had the blueprint not started with that. I think it would have been easier to get into. But that’s the major skeptic, I don’t believe I can think past reality. But the more you do it, the more you realize that you can push your goals further and further. And even if you don’t reach them, you’re still reaching higher than what you were thinking before.
– If something’s worthwhile doing it’s generally difficult. And I think that the personal success ritual is something that is absolutely difficult. It’s a real challenge, but the benefits of doing something so challenging can be immense. So Andrew, what’s been your experience? You know, here we are a few months down the track. Having done it, having gone through that challenge, what’s your experience today?
– I sort of do it religiously. But I do it often, I carry a diary now with motivational parts to it. It just, it’s on the top of my head all the time now. I’m finding that it’s helping my day, it’s helping my mental attitude, it’s helping everything that goes towards the business, the business is my life. I don’t believe I had any other part except the business. And this is helping incredibly.
– So the next part of the processes that prioritize daily action lists, which is all about your own personal productivity, who’s got some feedback about that? How challenging was it? How easy was it? What were the results? Since you’ve been starting to do a prioritized daily action list?
– It was a real benefit for me, because Philip didn’t do a lot of the stuff within the business only I did. So for him, got us talking. So in the morning, I’d say, look, what would you like to do? And could you do that for me today? And I’ll do this, because this isn’t really important. I need to do it. But could you take on this? So for us, I think that we’ve got things done more efficiently within the business, because we’re talking about it whereas before he just got to work in the morning. We wouldn’t talk about the business and I would just go in the office in and get done as much as I could. And then, you know, I sometimes you’d get a little bit upset, oh, why didn’t you get that done today? It’s happened and I have to prioritize. And, you know, I can’t do everything by myself. So I think for me, that was a really good thing. We working together now to get things done.
– The next part of blueprint, what it covers is what we call the the quality client pathway. Which I think seems to have the most impact on people like it’s the thing that the people are most skeptical about, because it’s about getting rid of the tire kickers and time wasters before they wasted time. It’s about an education process for your prospect. So they end up being good quality clients. And the punch line is that you get paid for your proposals, which is a big bone of contention out there. In the building industry, many, many builders are still saying you can’t do it. You won’t have, I’ve had those comments. You won’t have a business if you start charging for quotes, because you won’t get any work. That’s what I hear quite often. I find that this is the glory part of the blueprint program, even the PSR and then prioritize daily action list that first part, even though you’ve said it makes a major impact. It’s not something that builders think about, most builders think that they are working really hard already. How could I improve that? You know, and I think that particularly I’ve heard a lot from Andrew of late saying he’s getting a hell of a lot more done now. But it’s not something that I think builders are looking for how to get more done in less time. What they are looking for is better quality clients. Somebody tell us about their experience at the start of that quality client pathway when you’re starting to ask different questions when people contact you, and then ending up in the initial meeting where you’re saying the next part of the process or the next step is to pay for a proposal. What has been your experiences?
– With me the best time actually witnessing a client or prospect it was quite funny because Philip was waiting for me to say it and he kept he kept going. He said, “Oh, she’s about to say, oh no, she didn’t.” She’s still not going and he was waiting for me. It took forever and I kept trying to get the encouragement to actually say, and I thought oh, now or never, so let’s just do it. And I did it. And they didn’t actually flinch and I went, I thought I need a stiff drink. It just happened and I was so so nervous. And when I actually had the courage to do it, and they sort of thought, okay, and the more I do it now I’m just I’m ready to go. I’m ready that I can’t wait to actually say that.
– Well I do that sure, that was only three weeks into the course too, so.
– So let’s have a crack, see what happens.
– Try it, try it rough ready. There’s a bit of a build-up before that actually happens. So especially sitting there and listening to the clients, listening to what their wants and needs are too. So the first initial phone call that Cherie does now, I sit there and listen because I’m not good on the phone. So she sits there and has a bit of a chat to him and talks to him and, you know, it’s just amazing what she’s done in 16 weeks with that program. So yeah, it’s just unreal.
– So Louise, you guys are a little bit different. You’re doing smaller jobs. So instead of having a fee for a proposal, you guys offer a site visit fee. It’s a smaller job doesn’t take as long to sort of figure out what the price is. What was your experience when on the phone when people said can you come out and, you know, have a look at the job and give us a free quote? And you said.
– With ours I never really did calls with clients, and they did that sort of thing. So when we first started, the blueprint actually went into panic mode thinking, “Oh my goodness, I have to speak to clients.” So, that’s just not me. During the course of the weeks and, you know, just getting the courage and the belief to do it and doing the dirty reps as we call them and just trying to really work through the conversations, the triage call. So now we ask our clients for, when we’re finished the triage call for an on-site consultation fee. And then Andy can come out and you’ll get all of his expertise and knowledge for him to be able to quote on that job. And last week I had four out of five that said, “Yep, no problem.”
– Yeah, amazing.
– It works.
– Now Geoff, you’re the man in the crosshairs at JEDCO. When you’re talking about paid proposals, what are your thoughts? I’m interested in this because you were going, I don’t know about that might have this conversation. And now you got to do it.
– Absolutely, and do proudly and probably every customer now. The idea to develop an actual quality system that weeds out potential clients, just price shopping or aren’t ready to go the amount of time you save by doing that process, it’s been a couple of hours a day probably for me.
– Blowing up and getting quotes for people you never hear from again. So this idea of having a system that manages that process for you has been fantastic.
For us when we get to the point we also have developed as part of our initial questionnaire that we send out straight after the first phone call to get so much information up to use without having to waste time and having back and forth with the client, part of that system then transitions into an initial meeting.
We already have a fair bit of information about the project can discuss it with the client and then put it to them. Listen, our service, we charge for the fee, for the quote. We don’t do it for free.
– We’ve not yet had someone deny it, actually had for the first time in seven years ago, a guy pulled out his credit card and said I want to pay.
– There you go, look, I can’t take it.
– And actually we had to, months ago I got a dongle to make his payment and what to take payments, and never got to use it and I had to go hang on a minute. I’m gonna go get my phone and get this thing going.
So when people do that and axes of professionalism as it presents and the relationship you build with that client upfront sets the framework for everything that goes on further down the conversations, even before you’ve put an end to the jobs.
– That’s a really interesting point. Who else has got some experience about that, just the difference in the relationship, as sort of build moves forward, if they’ve paid for a proposal versus the old free? How’s the relationship differ?
– I put it down to look like it’s I’m driving the bus, is how I explain it rather than be a passenger, where the professional way our job is to drive the bus. That’s what our experience based on our experience and our business model and what we can do. It’s our responsibility in my mind to actually drive the bus.
But when you let the clients dictate when they come in, when they, you know, when we price the job, how we price the job, all those sorts of things, you kind of lose that rapport with the customer.
You’re no different from the other bloke down the road.
So by having a point of difference and say this is how we do it because of these reasons, it just changes the relationship. They’re more trusting, they’re more honest with you for their end budget, from their wants and desires, all of that stuff that you just building that relationship.
– I’ve always thought it’s the case if you get what you pay for, for us to see a customer walk in a tire kicking and price checking, you don’t know whether they’re going to become a customer or not.
As soon as you hit them with a hurdle, pay some money up front and they do, you’ve got them straightaway.
They’re a customer straightaway. And because they’re paying for it, they’re getting a better quality experience and we’re getting a better quality customer. 20 weeks ago, we were wondering where our next customer was coming from. Today I’d say we’re this close to being oversubscribed, with good quality customers.
– Phil, Cherie, what has been your experience with the difference in the relationship with your customers since you started getting paid proposals?
– Well this morning I went to a job site this morning and the client actually stayed there a bit late before he went to work to just thank me for what we’ve done and how we’ve helped him and everything else.
So it was just the whole journey. He’s nearly like a mate at the moment. He enjoys a few things that we do too. But for him to stick around like that, to be late at work, yeah, it was amazing.
So it was just that journey. We’re not even halfway through this build yet, but he’s already grateful, so to hear feedback from clients like that. Just had a meeting 10 minutes ago, that was our third meeting with them. They’re telling us their life stories and how great we are and how open we are and how thankful they are.
– It’s amazing how much you guys, all of you, have transformed your businesses in such a short time. I could stand here and say it’s because of the content and I created it. And none of that’s true.
The truth is that you guys got some information, and information is worthless unless it’s applied. That’s what I wanted to get across in this conversation is that there is information there, the only decision you need to make is, am I prepared? Am I open to it? And am I prepared to implement it?
So I’d just like to hear from each of you individually about your thoughts of your experience when you went from that skeptical, “Have we done the right thing about jumping into this Blueprint program?” to, “I think we’ve done the right thing by jumping into this Blueprint program.” How did that show up for each of you? If you want to start, Louise, what was that for you?
– The first few weeks when you’re just learning about everything that is possible when you’re actually, when you start applying it and realizing that it is possible, then you realize, yes, we definitely have the done the right thing.
Let’s get moving and let’s keep up the momentum and keep moving forward as much and as fast as we can to see where we can go with this.
– Cherie, what was your experience? What happened for you? When did you realize, “I think I was wrong”?
– I will admit that I was wrong. For me, I feel like I’m fresh in the business. I feel like now that I’m excited again and like I was when I first started. I’m excited to see where it’s gonna take us. Just loving the overall, the building industry again.
– Wow, that’s awesome to hear. Phil, what about yourself?
– Well, as you know, Cherie would have mentioned I found you when I was laying in a hospital bed with broken ribs. So when I got back into the office here and we started the program, I had a fair bit of spare time, I suppose. Because I was on the tools.
So I went crazy, I watched every module pretty well straight up. And I was implementing things every single day. Probably every couple of hours, I reckon I was trying something new.
Yeah, it changed that quick for us.
For me, it’s life-changing. It’s not just changed our business, it changed my life, as you know. I’ve never read a book in me life, now I’m up to number seven, I think.
– And you told me the other day that’d you just finished “The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People” by Stephen Covey, which is the most challenging book to read on the planet.
– It took me five weeks, Mick. That was heavy. Honestly, it’s change my life, not just the business. It’s life-changing.
– Andrew Pierce?
– From a skeptical person 20 weeks ago, probably three or four weeks in, I started to get a bit of a confident mind change. That’s encouraged me to go a little bit deeper, to read more, to listen to more of your talks. Probably a bit like Phil, it’s changed my life more so than the business.
Like I said before, the business is my life, but this has changed my whole attitude towards the building industry. 20 weeks ago, I was ready to jump under a bus. I was sick of it, been doing this for so many years. It wasn’t getting where I wanted it to be.
Now I can see the projection, everything looks up, everything looks positive and I’m renewed. I’m ready to start again. Let’s how I’m go in 20 years, laughing.
– And the interesting thing with your comments here is that you guys started right in the guts of the whole COVID pandemic. And there was a lot of doom and gloom.
– Yeah, the COVID didn’t help. We weren’t doing so well before it. It looked deadly during it for the business. Now we’re still in COVID and we’re doing more than we’ve ever done. It’s amazing.
– Geoff, what was your experience?
– I started looking around for some inspiration and to help with the business. I was actually looking for just a forum or something that we could be associated with with other builders.
But to actually come across the program like yours, like this is, is a complete mind change and mindset change of how things are done, what should be the normal.
We got so set in our ways of doing things that we couldn’t see anything better above other than head down and just keep doing the same thing over and over again.
To get to a point where you can sit back for a minute and analyze what you’re doing and then realize there is a ton of information out there that can make things better for you to change the way you think in your own mind, the flow-on effect from that through the business and through your own personal life has been, in just 12 weeks has been amazing.
Just went from something that was same as Andrew, I guess, had enough, really didn’t want to come to work every day almost at that point. Got to the stage where you just, what’s the point of it all?
But now, with a set goal in mind, with a better quality customer, happy customers at the end, building a better business, it just changes the whole feeling of the industry.
– It’s a no-brainer for us.
– I want to thank you all for participating in this conversation for a couple of reasons.
One, at such short notice. The main thing I want to thank you for is your effort, because as I said, and Geoff just said, there’s a lot of information out there, a lot of really great information, and the information is worthless until and unless it is implemented and it is committed to.
And I hope that the people watching this and listening to this can get some idea that, yeah, there’s a lot of good information out there, but all you have to do is be prepared to back yourself, implement that information.
I guess, from what Geoff has also said, I think the key to it is being in a group, even if it’s a small group of people who are going through the same thing. All of you guys went through the program together.
You started at the same time, sort of finished at the same time, and you helped each other along that pathway. And I think that there’s a lot of value in that, being with people who are going through the same challenges.
You’re sharing those challenges, but you’re also sharing the support, you’re sharing the wins, you’re helping each other learn better and faster. I just want to tip my hat to you guys for putting the effort in to make this happen.
The information’s the information, but if you’re willing to back yourself, you can make amazing things happen.
So, thanks for being on the show. I look forward to the journey in the future with you with great anticipation. It’s gonna be really, really exciting. If you can accomplish this in the last 20 weeks, imagine what’s gonna happen in 200 weeks.
Summary & Where to go from here
So there you have it, some people who have implemented some ideas, they were open enough to implement the ideas that we talk about in both our Blueprint program, and now they’re in the Blackbelt program. And so, I want to offer you the opportunity to at least have a conversation.
We talked to a lot of builders. We are doing everything we can to help every single builder that reaches out to us. And we’ve got a bunch of options.
Obviously there’s Blackbelt. That’s not suitable for everyone. And we’ve also got the Blueprint program, and that might not be suitable to you. So we’ve got a heap of free resources that we could offer you as well.
But if you’re an established builder, it’s important that you’re established, if you’re still sort of in the first year or in the early stages of building your business, what I suggest to you is jump into the Builders Business Success Forum.
That’s our free Facebook group. You can jump in there and ask heaps of questions, and we can help you along the way. What you’ll get out of that is basically what you put into it. The amount that you put into it and ask questions.
We’ll be there to support you for sure and certain.
But if you’re an established builder and you’re absolutely sick and tired of having your time wasted by price shoppers and tire kickers, people who aren’t quite ready for you yet, and you want to process to be able to turn that around, get them out of business.
If they are appropriate for you, teach them how to be a better quality client so you can fill your business with high quality clients and finally get paid for the time, your intellectual property and knowledge and the experience that goes into putting a professionally prepared quote together, let’s have a chat.
And we wanna be able to help you move in the direction to implement all of that into your business. And it’s as simple as just clicking the button underneath this video, under here, or you can go to our website if you’re just listening to the audio version.
You can see that there’ll be Schedule a Call buttons all over the place. We’ll just jump on the call, find out what’s comfortable for you, what makes sense for you, because you don’t have to continue experiencing all of this frustration, wasted time, wasted money.
You can change your business so you really enjoy working with really good high quality people who are prepared to pay you appropriately for your skills and abilities.
So if that’s something you wanna talk about, we’re more than happy to chat. Click the button, jump on a call, and we’ll be back with another episode of Builders Business Success Podcast before you know it.
That is it. I’m Mick Hawes, Builders Business Blackbelt. Bye for now.